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ウナ仕方ヲシタカト申シマスルト云フト\n煉瓦ハ總テ東京ノ小菅カラ送ツタ、土地ノ煉瓦ヲ用井タコトガ少々ノモノ\nデ、煉瓦ハ八分九分位ハ東京デ取ツタ東京デ取ツタト云フノミナラズ、一\n體斯ウ云フモノハ非常ニ運賃ガ掛レバ高クナルモノデアリマスガ何分急施\nノ工事デアルカラ間ニ合ハナイ蒸汽船デ東京カラ取ツタ、ソレカラ川蒸汽\nニ移ツテサウシテ油島其他ノ門扉ニハ總テ汽船デ斯ウ云フヤウナ粗製物ヲ高\nイ運賃ヲ拂ツテ東京カラ取ツタソレカラ閘門ニ使ツタ御影石ハ東京デハ隨\n分貴イモノデアリマスガ、非常ニ良ク拵ヘ瓣ナドヲ取ツテ作ツテアリマス\nソレハ何處カラ取ツタカト云フト伊勢ノ四日市ヨリ凡ソ六七里奧山ノ奧カ\nラ土木會社ノ人ガ切出シテ來タト云フ、斯ウ云フ話デアル、ソレカラ縣廳デ\n聞キ、土木會社ノ人ニ聞キ、總體ノ者ニ聞ケバ、大層工事ニ關係ノ人カラ聞ケ\nバ用材ガ甚タ乏シクナツタト云フ、用材ガ無イノテ、今材木ヲ用井レバ高ク\nナルト云フ、其閘門ノ土臺ニ使ツタ、ソレハダウ云フモノヲ用井テヤツテア\nルト云フト、是ハ松ノ木ヲ用井タケレドモ凡ソ一ノ閘門ヲ一万才ノ材ヲ用井\nタこんくりーとデ堅メテアリマス、隨分一万才ト云フヤウナモノハ材木ノ\n厚ミ、ソレカラ煉瓦ノヤウナ粗製ノ物ヲ汽船ニ積ムベキモノデハナイモノ\nヲ積ミ、ソレカラ恐ロシイ贅澤ナ御影石ノ工事ヲバ遠方カラ切出シテ汽船ニ\n積ンデ持ツテ來ルト云フ有樣デアリマスカラ非常ナ高價ニ就イテ居ルト云\nハレルモ云ハレルシ、私共ノ見ル所デモ非常ナ普請デアルト斯ウ考ヘル、其\n上此工事ハ頗ル贅澤ヲ極メタル工事デアツテ、總テ五箇所ノ煉瓦石造ノ閘門\nト云フモノハ扉ヲバ二ツ振リ作ツテアリマス、(此時古市君ドンナニデスト問\nフ)閘門ノ扉ガ二ツアル平生少シノ水量ガ增シタ時分ハ小サイ扉ヲ閉チ\nル、大洪水ノ時ハ閘門一杯ノ扉ヲ閉チル扉ガ二通リアリマス從來閘門ガ六\n尺バガリノ處デ、平生水ガ一杯溜ツテ居テ、自在ニ船ヲ行ルコトガ出來ル、惡\n水落シノ中ニ河ガアリマスカラ、自在ニ閘門ノ中ヲ大キナ船デモ川蒸汽船位\nナラ通ルコトガ出來マス、其他せめんとヲ築キ堰堤ヲシタトカ、左右ニ堤防\nヲ築イタトカ云フコトガゴザリマスガ先ヅサウ云フ仕事ハ卽チ復舊工事デ\nアルカ、又一體前ノ割合ニ致スト六尺角ノモノガ八尺角ヲ用井、最初ノ目的カ\nラシマスト拾萬五千圓ノ金額ガ減タノデアルカラ、八ノモノガ七ツシカ出\n來ナイ譯デアルガ、是ナラバ斯樣ナ大改良ノ工事ヲシタト云フ結果ガアル\nソレカラ又高津橋ノ聞門ハ二ノ眼鏡ノヤウニ出來テ居マスガ此中デ最モ\n大キナ閘門デス、ソレカラ高河原ノ閘門ハ一ノ眼鏡デ其方ハ受負ノ價ガ廉イ\nト云フ、併シ賃額ハ何程デ受合ツタカ要領ハ得マセヌ縣廳デ聞イテモ答ヘ\nズ、能ク覺エヌト言ヒ技手ニ聞イテモ能ク〓ヘナイ、大體ハ分リマセウガ高\n河原ノ閘門ハ斯樣ナ寫眞ヲ貰ツテ來マシタガ、是ハ第二ノ小イ方ノ工事デ\nス、此事ハ十万餘圓ノ金ヲ減ジ、岐阜ニ於テハ十五万圓ノ金ヲ減シタノニ、\n斯ノ如キモノガ出來ルト云フノハ上申ノ主旨ニ相反スルモノデアル、此事ニ\n就イテ一體政府ハ何云フ御考デアルカ、或ハ縣知事ハ尙ホ復舊ト云フコトヲ\n言フヤ否ヤ此事ヲ御尋致シマス、ソレカラ此第一工事ニ二百二十五万圓ト云\nフ堤防樋管ノ工費ハ復舊ノ方デ殆ド設計ヲセラレタト云フガ、政府モ亦復舊\nノ工事ト御覽ニナツテ居ルカ如何デアルカ併セテ伺ツテ置キタイ、\nソレカラ今一ツ私ガ彼地ヘ漫遊シテ著キ感覺ヲ惹起シタノハ政府ハ抑モ施\n政上平等ヲ得ヌト云フ憾ミガアル、ソレハ何デアルカト申スト、先ヅ此ノ三\n重縣ト愛知縣ノ對岸ハドウカト云フト矢張リ中島村トカ楠村トカ云フモノ\nハ堤防ガ陷落シテ一方ハドン〓〓工事ガ········政府ノ所謂特別ノ下金\nガアリマスカラ工事ガ落成致スニ一方ハ矢張リ地方稅ヲ集メタリ町村稅ヲ\n取タリシテ工事ニ着手シ、稍ク掛ツタノハ先月末ノ實況デアルソレカラ家\nノ潰レタノハドノ位アルカト申セバ、此ノ二村モ矢張リ家ガ潰レテ居ル、道\n路モ隨ツテ陷落シ破壞シテ居ル場所ガアル、最ウ一ツ進ンデ申スト三重縣ノ\n桑名郡多度村ト岐阜縣ノ下石津郡ノ境村ト云フ村ニピツタリ接近シテ居ル、\n此ノ多度村ノ佐藤吉三郎ト云フ人ハ此人ノ家ガ潰レテ其郎宅ノ內ノ建家ノ中\nノ柱ガ一本程岐阜縣ニ掛ツテ居ル、其先キニ居ル人ハ幸ヒ岐阜縣ノ人デ潰レ\nナカツタガ、其手前ノ家ハ潰レタガ柱ガ一本アルノデ、ドフ云フ目安デ實究致\nシマシタカ岐阜縣カラ一本ノ柱ニ對シテ八十何錢ト云フモノヲ呉レマシタ\n其邊ノ實況ヲ見マスルト佐藤吉三郞ノ家ノ柱ガ一本係ツタ人ノ家ハ破壞シ\nテ、其次キニモ壞レタモノガ二三軒アリマスガ、悉ク倒レ或ハ半潰ト云フ有樣\nデアル尤モ政府ハ如何ナル御考デアツタカ一方ノ人民ハ却テ此ノ政府ニ租\n稅ヲ出シ、同ジク壞サレテ居ルノニ一方ハドンノ思賜金ガアリ、政府ノ工\n事デアツテ金ヲ取ルコトガ出來ル、一方ノ人民ハ稍ク未ダ租稅ヲ拂ツテ堤防\nヲ造ルコトヲ計畫シ、家ノ潰レタモノハ其儘ニナツテ居ル又越前ノ福井邊\nノ景狀ニ於テモ隨分左樣ナ譯デアル、此隣縣篤志ノ人ガ愛知岐阜ニ向ツテ義\n捐金ヲシタノハ、ソレハ何カト云フト、ヨモヤ斯ノ如ク巨大ノ金ヲ愛知岐阜\nニ向ツテ政府カラ下ケルモノデハナイト思ツテ箇樣ニ慈善心カラ隣縣ノ人\nハ勿論全國カラ來タノデスガ、其比例ヲ云フト矢張災害ニ罹ツタ人民ガ愛知\n岐阜ニ最モ害ガ多イカラ金ヲ送ツタノデ、政府カ箇樣ナ金ヲ出シタカラ反\n對ノ結果ヲ見テ多少ノ害ヲ受ケタカ、同胞相憐ムノ情ヨリ金ヲ送ツテ、一ガ\nハ反對ノ結果ヲ來タシタハ施政其當ヲ得ナイト私ハ存ズルノデアル、此金額\nヲ出シマシタ當時ハドウ云フ御考デアリマシタカ全ク道路ヲ接シ僅ニ五寸\nカ六寸デ管轄境ニ家ガ接近シテ居マスガ、先ヅ復舊ノ工事デアルヤ否ヤ又施\n政上ニ就キマシタハ斯ウ云フ他ノ縣ノ人ヲマヽ子視シセラレタト云フハ如\n何ナル御處分デアルヤ否ヤト云フコトヲ御問申シマス","startPage":3,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000310436X00118920516/46"},{"speechID":"000310436X00118920516_047","speechOrder":47,"speaker":"古市公威","speakerYomi":"ふるいちきみたけ","speakerGroup":"茶話会","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年9月1日～大正13年1月16日","speech":"○政府委員(古市公威君)　復舊堤防ノ工事目論見ハ內務省デシタ云々ト云フ\nコトデスガ、能クドウ云フ工合ニ調ベタカヲ一應御話シシマセウト思ヒマス、\nサウシマスト調べ方ニ依ツテ十万圓減ツタコトモ分リマス、何分岐阜ノ堤防\nノ損害ト云フモノハ大變ナ區域ノ廣イ所ヘモツテキテ、春水ヲ防グト云フヤ\nウニ工事ヲ運バナケレバナラヌト云フテ非常ニ急イデ居タト云フコトハ御\n推察下サラウト思ヒマスソレニ早ク調ヲシナケレバナラヌトカ急ニ調ベ\nヤウガ無イカト云フ時ニ、岐阜愛知倶ニ第四ノ土木監督署ノ管轄デ此ノ第\n四土木監督署長ガ震災地ニ出張シテ居ツテ總理大臣ガ御前モ一ツ元ト土木\nノ工事ハ縣廳ノ管轄デアルカ御前モ手傳ツテ早ク調ヲシタラ宜イダラウト\n云フテ、手傳ノ主意デ彼レハヤツタノデス、ソコデ急ニヤラナケレバナラ\nヌ一週間ト云フ約束デヤツタ所ガ、岐阜揖斐二川及ヒ其他ハ大ナルモノバ\nカリテ、堤防ノ長サ八十里ト唱エテ居ル損害シタ部分バカリハ是ハトテモ\n當リ前ノ何村ノ町步ハ何處カラ何處迄、堀土ガ實測ノ上何程デ、盛土ガ幾ラ\nト一々當ツテ居ツテハ中々調ガ付キマセヌニ依ツテ、斯ウ云フ調方ヲシタ、\n元〓算ノ見込ヲ立テル丈デ實行スルトキニハ別ニ目論見ヲシナケレバナラ\nヌト云フコトデ、〓算ヲ立テルニ害ノ多少ニ依ツテ二三段ニ分ケテ一番ヒド\nカラウト思フ所ヲ十八町トカ二十町トカ云フモノヲ取リマシテ、ソコデ其標\n準ノ目論見ヲシタ、此目論見ハ豫メ普通ノ堤防ノ目論見ヲスル樣ニシタ、此\n龜裂ノ深サ何ポニ堀ツテ土ヲ以テ築キ立テヽ見テ、何程不足ダカラ何程他カ\nラ以テ來ナケレバナラヌト云フノデ、堀坪ガ幾ラ撞固メガ幾ラ、他カラ持テ來\nルノガ何程ト云フモノヲ二三度拵ヘマス、ソレガ八十里アルノデアルカラ手\n分ヲシテ迴ツタ所ガ、此堤防ハ何處カラ何處迄甲號ノ損害ト認メテ長サ幾ラ\nト土坪幾ラト云フコトヲ勘定スル、ソレカラ甲號ノ損害ノ一間當リノ損害ト\n云フモノハ一間ニ就イテ八坪トシテモ其八坪勿論土取場所ノ便宜ニ依ツテ金\n高ガ違フ、坪數丈ヲ堀坪固メ坪盛坪此坪數丈ヲ標準ニ取ツテ何坪ト云フコト\nデ、ソレカラ割リ立テル、金ハドウスル、其處ノ常式普請ノ豫算ニ取ツテ常式\n普請ノ所ハ何人アタリ土取場六ケ敷イ所ハ何人當リトカ常式普請ニ極ツタ\n率ヲ掛合セルノデ金ガ違フ、サウ云フ工合ニシテ目論見ヲ立ツタ堤防ノ調\nハ······樋管ノ方ハ餘程ヒドクヒツクリカヘツタモノデナケレバ分ラヌ上ニ堤\n防ガアルカラ中ニハ堤防ノ馬踏迄脫ケテ小蓋ガ落チテ上カラズボント穴ガ\n明イタノモアル、中ニハ入口ノ倒レテ是ハ著イ損害ガ分ル所ガ、サウデナイ損\n害ノ分ラヌモノガアル、水ハ現ニ溜ツテ居ルニ違ヒナイ、水ハ通ズルニ違ヒナ\nイ所モ損ジテ居ルニ違ヒナイ、何程損ジテ居ルカソレヲ調ベル暇ガナイ其レ\nデ全體ノ樋管ノ七分通リハ存シタ者ト認メルサウスルト伏替ガ何ンボト斯\nウ云フ工合ニ見込ヲ立テマシタソレカラコチラデ減シタノハ全體ガサウ云\nフ調ベダカラコチラデハ餘リイライジヤナイカ七分ジヤ-損害ノ事ハコ\nチラニモ分ツテ居リマスカラ、成丈內場ニシテ置ケバ善イカラ樋管ノ方ハ\n堤防ノ方ハ目安ガ立ツテモ樋管ノ方デ少シ控ヘテ置ク、サウスレバ百五\n拾万デ濟ムダラウカラト云フノデ減ラシタヨリ外ニ原因ハナイ、樋管ノ七分\nヲ五分ト看レバ此金デ修マルカラ、サウシテ置カウト云フノデ、斯ウ云フ\n工合ニシテ減シタノデアル、損害モ勿論アラウガ愛知ノ方ノ遣リ方ハ、尤モ\n愛知ニハ技師ガアルツレデ岐阜ノ調方ヲ聞キマシテ、サウシテ愛知ノ方デモ\n同ジ仕方デ庄內川木曾川ノ堤防ノ調ベモ同ジデ樋管ノ損ジタノガ何程ト云\nフノ見込ヲ立テヽ出シマシタ、大體少シ違ツテ居ルコトハ愛知ノ方ハ樋管\n大小殘ラズ出シマシタ、岐阜ノ方ハ堤防モ外受ケ堤川ヲヂカニ受ケテ居ル\n內〓堤デナイ方樋管モソレニ付イテ居ル、樋管ハ愛知ノ方ハ殘ラズ出シマシ\nタ、勿論調漏レモアラウガ殘ラズ出シタ其中ノ大キナ者ヲ拔イテサウシテ\n六拾五萬圓ノ見込ヲ立テヽ河川ノ堤防トソレニ附屬シタ大キナ樋管ト云フノ\nデ六拾五萬圓ノ見込ヲ立テマシタマダ〓〓愛知ノ方デハ其時ニハ巳ニ道路\nダノ何ダノ分ツタ者ハ書出シテゴザイマスケレトモ先ヅ川ヲ第一トシテ川\nノ分トソレカラ樋管ノ大キナ分ヲ其中カラ引拔イテ六拾五萬圓是丈ノ金額ヲ\n出サウト云フコトニ極ツタ、ソレカラサウ云フ調べデゴザンスカラ、極其精\n密ノ度合ハ之ヲ他ノ尋常ノ水門ノ補助ヲ請求スル場合ノ調方抔ニ比スルト云\nフト餘程粗漏ト云ハナケレバナラヌ、尋常ノ水門、富山福岡ノ如キ時ヲ經ツ\nテ補助ノ調査ガ出タガアレ等ノ如キハ、丸デ補助ノ違ウ計畫ヲシタ、ソレヲ\n調査スル方法モ餘程綿密デアル、此方ノ目論見ノ方ハ確實愛知ノ方ハ何分急\nクト云フノデ、大體ニ付イテ金高ヲ極メテサウシテ金ヲ出シマシタ、ソレカラ\n又復舊デナイト云フ御話デゴザイマスガ、勿論復舊ト云フコトハソレハ隨分\n喧シク云ツテ居ル復舊ヨリ外ノ事ハ出來ヌト云フコトヲ云ツテ居ル、ソレデ\n復舊デナイ所ノ斯ノ如キ木造水門ガ煉瓦造水門ニ爲ツタト云フコトハ他ニ理\n由ガアル、其理由ハアナタモ御話デゴザリマシタガ、今ノ通ノ木材ノ供給ガ此\n頃大變ニ六ヶ敷ナツテ居ル、普通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\n十四條ノ第二項ニ依ツテ承諾スベキヤ否ヤト云フコトニ就イテ、意見ヲ立テ\r\nルノハ勿論デアリマスガ、只今決シマシタ其事柄ヲ云ヘバ憲法違反ノモノ\r\nデアルト云フコトニ滿場一致デ決シテアリマス違反ノ事柄ハドウカト云フ\r\nト、六十四條ノ二項ニ依ツテ支出スルコトノ出來ヌモノデアル、二項ニ當ラヌ\r\n事柄ヲヤツタカラ、政府ガ憲法違反デアル、卽チ二項ニ當嵌ラヌコトニナツタ\r\n時ハ二項ニ毫モ緣故ノナイモノデアル、緣故ノナイノニ憲法六十四條二\r\n項ニ依ツテ承諾ヲ求メルト云フコトヲヤツテ來レハ、六十四條ノ二項ニ當嵌\r\nラヌ、六十四條二項デハ斯ンナコトハ出來ヌ、夫ニ斯ウ云フ事ヲシタノハ\r\n憲法違反ノ所爲ト云フコトハ充分責得ラルヽコトハ勿論ノ事デアル、サウシ\r\nテ責メテ行丈ノコトハ、憲法違反ト云フ箇條デ政府ノ所爲ヲ責メテ行キマス\r\nカラ、之ヲ二項ニ當嵌ラヌモノヲ、二項デ承諾セズト決スルコトハ可笑シカ\r\nラウ、而シテ毫モ二項ニ關係ノナイモノトスレバ、此案ハ何ニ依ツテ政府ガ\r\n出シタカト云フニ六十四條ノ二項ニ依ツテ出シタノデアルガ、二項ハサウ\r\n云フモノデナイトシタトキハ六十四條ノ二項ニ依ツテ不承諾ト云フコトヲ\r\n決スルコトハ出來ナイテンデ斯ンナモノヲ議會ニ出スベキデナイノニ、之\r\nヲ議會ヘ持ツテ來タノハ筋違ダト云フコトデ、返シテ仕舞フト云フノガ至\r\n當ノ話デアル、政府ノ憲法違反ハ夫デ責メテ置クガ宜シカラウ、詰リ不承諾\r\nト云フコトハ六十四條ノ二項デアルガ、私共ノ考デハ、詰リ六十四條ノ二項\r\nニ當嵌ラヌモノデアルカラ、諾否ヲ云フコトハ出來ヌト考ヘテ居ル","startPage":2,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000210437X00718911222/22"},{"speechID":"000210437X00718911222_023","speechOrder":23,"speaker":"東尾平太郎","speakerYomi":"ひがしおへいたろう","speakerGroup":"弥生倶楽部","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年7月1日～明治24年12月25日","speech":"○(東尾平太即君)　私ハ大津君ノ說ニ反對デ、憲法違反ト極ツタ以上ハ不承\r\n諾デ宜シカラウト考ヘマス、今大津君ノ議論ヲ聽イテ見マスト、憲法六十四條\r\nノ第二項ハ唯豫備費ノ支出ヲ規定シタモノデ、二十三年ノ剩餘金ハ之ニ關係\r\nノナイコトデアル、第二項ノ豫備費ニ關スルコトハ、承諾不承諾デモ宜シイ\r\nガ、第二項以外ノ費用デアルカラ、六十四條二項ニ依ツテ承諾スルコトガ出\r\n來ナイト云フノハ一種ノ僻論デアルト思フ、若シ政府カ今大津君ノ御議論\r\nニシテ、政府ガ承諾ヲ求メテ居ルニ、是ハ承諾スベカラサルモノトシタトキ\r\nニハ其結果ハドウナルカ、我々ハ憲法ニ依ッテ·······其憲法ノ條項ニ箝ラナ\r\nイトキニ、不承諾ヲ云フノハ、我々ノ權利ト思ヒマスカラ、議會自ラガ憲法\r\nヲ放棄シナイ樣ニ願ヒマス","startPage":2,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000210437X00718911222/23"},{"speechID":"000210437X00718911222_024","speechOrder":24,"speaker":"高田早苗","speakerYomi":"たかださなえ","speakerGroup":"議員集会所","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年7月1日～明治24年12月25日","speech":"○(高田早苗君)　私モ今日始テ伺ツタノデスガ、大津君ノ御話ハ一理アル御\r\n說デアル、六十四條第二項ニ由ツテ來タ事柄ヲ、其由ツテ來タノハ宜シイトシ\r\nテモ、尙ホ承諾不承諾······混合スル恐ガアルト云フ御說デアルガ、併ナガラ\r\n承諾セント欲スルモ得ベカラザル事柄デアルカラ、故ニ不承諾デアルト云フ\r\nコトヲ言ヘナイコトハナイ成程言葉ハ同ジ言葉ヲ二ツノ意味ニ用フルノデ\r\n混合スルト云フ樣ナ恐ガアルカモ知レナイケレドモ、唯返スト云フテモ、異\r\nナモノデアルト私ハ思フ、夫デ此區別ニ御氣ノ付カレタ所ハ至極御尤デア\r\nルじ、併シ承諾シヤウト思ツテモ、承諾ノ出來ナイモノデアルカラ、承諾ハ\r\nシナイノデアルト云フコトハ言ヘナイコトハナヒ、言ツテ差支ナイコトデ、\r\n只今東尾君ノ御說ノ如ク、之ニ依ル承諾ト、大體ノ承諾ト之ニ依ル不承諾\r\nト大體ノ不承諾ガアルト思ヒマスカラ、承諾ト云フ文字ト云フ文字ヲ用ヒテ、\r\n差支ナイト思ヒマス","startPage":2,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000210437X00718911222/24"},{"speechID":"000210437X00718911222_025","speechOrder":25,"speaker":"川越進","speakerYomi":"かわごえすすむ","speakerGroup":"巴倶楽部","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年7月1日～明治24年12月25日","speech":"○(川越進君)　昨日本員モ矢張大津君ト同一ナ考ヲ持ツテ居ル者ダガ、今東\r\n尾君高田君ノ御說モゴザイマスケレドモ一體事物ニハ必ズ表ト裏ノアルト\r\n云フコトハ、皆樣御承知ノコトデアル、物アレバ必ズ表裏ト云フモノガナクテ\r\nハナラヌシテ見レバ、承諾シナイト云フ以上ハ一方ニハ承諾スルト一ムフコ\r\nトガアツテ、初メテ承諾シナイト云フコトガ起ツテ來ル勘定デアル、此事柄\r\nヲ議會ハ如何ナル場合ニ於テモ憲法違反ノ處置ト見テ、斯樣ナモノニハ決シ\r\nテ議會ガ承諾スベキモノデナイト云フ以上ハ、之ニ對シテ承諾スルト云フコ\r\nトガ更ニナイモノトシテ見レバ、之ニ對シテ承諾シナイト云フコトガアラウ\r\n筈ハナイ裏許リアラウ筈ハナイ、尙ホ譬ヘテ申シマスレバ、彼請願書ノ如\r\nキ或ハ憲法規則ニ從ツテ持ツテ出タモノハ、兎ニ角夫ヲ受付ケテ-受理\r\nシテサウシテ請願ノ事柄ト云フモノハ或ハ之ヲ許可シ或ハ聞屆ケナイト\r\n云フコトガ起ツテ來ル、然ニ若シ規則ニ違ヒ憲法ニ背ク請願ヲ持ツテ來マシ\r\nタナラバ、議會ト雖モ之ヲ受理スベキモノデナイ、受理スルコトノ出來ナイ\r\nモノデアル受理スベキモノデナイトスルナラバ、其中ニ這入ラナイ、這入\r\nラナイト云バ則チ其物ニ對シテ其願ハ聞屆ケヤウカ、聞屆ケマイカ、勿論\r\n是ハ規則ニ違ツテ居ル願デアルカラ、聞屆ケナイデ宜シイト云フ、聞屆ケ難\r\nイト云フ指令ヲ下スコトハ出來ナイ、夫ト同ジコトデアル、無イ物ニ向ツテ、\r\n空物ニ向ツテ、承諾ヲシナイト云フコトヲ唱ヘルト同ジデアルドウモ私ハ\r\n之ニ就イテ承諾シナイ······ト仰ツシヤルノハ私ニ於テドウモ分ラナイ","startPage":2,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000210437X00718911222/25"},{"speechID":"000210437X00718911222_026","speechOrder":26,"speaker":"山田東次","speakerYomi":"やまだとうじ","speakerGroup":"弥生倶楽部","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年7月1日～明治24年12月25日","speech":"○(山田東次君)　大津君及川越君ノ御說ヲ承リマス所ガ、成程一應御尤ナ御\r\n說デハアリマスルガ、少々私抔トハ考ノ違ツテ居ル所モアリマスカラ、應\r\n意見ヲ述べマスガ、一體此憲法ニ違反ヲシテ居ル所爲デアルカラ、議會ハ承\r\n諾不承認ヲ云フコトカ出來ナイト云フコトハ私ハナイコトダラウト思フ、\r\n我々ガ承諾ヲシマイト云フノハ畢竟憲法ニ政府ノ手續ガ違反シテ居ルカラ\r\n承諾ヲシナイノデアツテ、若モ合法ノ所爲卽チ憲法ニ合シタル所ノ所爲デア\r\nツタナラバ、我々ガ之ヲ承認スルト云フ說ヲ出スカモ知レナイ、畢竟違反デ\r\nアルカラ承認ヲシナイト云フノデアル、一體此政府ガ今度出シタ所ノ二百五\r\n號ノ緊急勅令ト云フモノガ、第六十四條第二項ニ當ラヌノデ、外カラ持ツテ\r\n來レバ此所爲ハ合憲ノ所爲デアル、卽チ憲法ニ合シタル所爲デアルト云フナ\r\nラバカウ云フ御說モ或ハ起ルカ知ラヌガ、此二百五號ノ緊急勅令ト云フモ\r\nノハ、獨リ六十四條第二項ニ當ラヌ許リデハナイ、何處ヘ持ツテ行ツタ所ガ\r\n違憲ノ所爲デアル、絕對的ニ違憲ノ所爲デアル、シテ見ルト云フト、此絕對\r\n的違憲ノ所爲ヲ議會ニ向ツテ同意ヲ求メテ來タトキニ-承諾ヲ求メテ來タ\r\nトキニ議會デ以テ之ヲ何トモ議スコトガ出來ナイト云フ譯ニハ行カナイ、\r\n一體是ハ憲法違反デアルカラ、承諾シナイトカ、スルトカ云フ所ノ、之ヲ議\r\n決スルト云フ權利ヲ持ツテ居ラナケレバナラナイ、故ニ之ガ憲法違反デアル\r\nト決シタ以上ハ、議會ガ承認不承認ヲ議スコトガ出來ナイト云フ譯ハナカラ\r\nウト思フ、故ニ此返付ヲスル-政府ノ方ニ違憲ノ所爲トシテ返付スルト云\r\nフ說ニハ私ハ反對ヲ致ス者デアリマス","startPage":3,"speechURL":"https://teikokugikai-i.ndl.go.jp/txt/000210437X00718911222/26"},{"speechID":"000210437X00718911222_027","speechOrder":27,"speaker":"犬養毅","speakerYomi":"いぬかいつよき","speakerGroup":"議員集会所","speakerPosition":null,"speakerElection":null,"officeTerm":"明治23年7月1日～明治24年12月25日","speech":"○(犬養毅君)　私ハ之ヲ考ヘタラ一番早ク議論ガ分リハセヌカト思ヒマス\r\nガ、若シ政府ガ憲法ニ背カナイ支出ノヤリ方ヲヤツテ、夫デ承諾ヲ求メテ來\r\nタト云フ場合、卽チ通常アルベキ場合ニハドウデアルカト云フト、-其時\r\nニハ事實上ノ問題、政略上ノ問題丈殘リマス、議會ガ開ケル迄待テタカ待テ\r\nナカツタカト云フコト丈デ、違憲デアルトカ云フコトハ當リ前ニ行ケバ、起\r\nラナカツタノデアルデ、此震災會ハ不幸ニシテ一一ツノ種類カラ成立テ之ヲ審\r\n査シナケレバナラヌ、全體當リ前ニ政府ガ憲法ヲ履ンデ居ルナラバ、政略上\r\nノ問題丈デアルガ、其外ニ違憲ト云フコトガ一ツ起テ居ルカラ、二ツノ種\r\n類カラ成立テ來テ居ル、一方ニハ憲法ニ反對スル反對シテ居ルカラ、承諾\r\nヲシナイ、又事實ノ上ニ於テ待レルトカ待レヌトカ、待タルベキモノヲ待タ\r\nズシテヤツタト云フ、卽チ事實ニ屬スベキモノト二ツ合シテ居ルデス、夫ヲ\r\n考ヘタラ直グ分ルダラウト思フ、憲法上ニ背カズシテ出タトキニハ、事實ノ\r\n問題ヨリ外ナイ、只憲法六十四條第二項ニ依ルベカラザルモノヲ、依ツタカ\r\nラ更ニ違憲ト云フ問題ガ出テ來ル、夫ガナケレバ、事實ノ問題丈ダ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